10/30/2009 6:00:00 AM
Salem fields solar questions at town hall
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KINGMAN - Kingman Mayor John Salem attempted to answer questions about the city's proposed sale of effluent water to Hualapai Valley Solar, near Red Lake, during a town hall meeting Wednesday evening. Around 15 people attended the meeting at the Kingman Library.
Hualapai Valley Solar was invited to the town hall meeting but was unable to send a representative because of a meeting in Phoenix, Salem said.
Hualapai Valley Solar has offered to purchase treated wastewater from the Kingman Hilltop Wastewater Treatment Plant once the city finishes upgrades.
"We're working on an agreement and water policy now," Salem said. How much the city would charge for the water would depend on how much it would cost the city to treat the water to Hualapai Valley Solar's specifications. The city would have to break even on the deal in order to prevent residents from footing the bill, he said.
Representatives from Hualapai Valley Solar have previously said that the treated water would be used to run the plant and cut back on the amount of water they would have to pump directly from the ground.
Salem estimated the plant could supply the solar facility with about 1.4 million gallons of effluent a day. The city was going to sell the water to someone, whether it was a golf course, a solar plant or a business at the airport, he said.
If Hualapai Valley Solar plans to sink four wells as a backup, resident Susan Bayer asked what would prevent the company from just using the water from the wells and abandoning the idea of using effluent. She also asked about the possibility of contaminated water being put back into the ground from the plant.
Salem said he didn't know about the company's plan for its wells, but he did know the company would need the effluent to prove to the Arizona Corporation Commission and other state agencies that it had more than enough water to run the plant.
He also thought it unlikely the company would build a pipeline from the Kingman wastewater plant to the solar plant and then abandon the idea after getting approval from the ACC.
The plant would also have to follow regulations from the ACC, Arizona Department of Environmental Quality and other state agencies, Salem said. The city wouldn't sell water to a company that didn't follow state regulations.
Mike Bihuniak of Residents Against Irresponsible Development, which hosted the town hall, asked if there was any way to encourage the company to use photovoltaic solar cell technology instead of concentrated solar technology. Concentrated solar technology uses mirrors and more water than photovoltaic technology.
That was something residents needed to ask the company, Salem said. As he understood it, photovoltaic technology was more expensive and required more land than concentrated solar.
Another resident asked if there was some way to convince the company to use dry- or hybrid-cooling instead of wet-cooling since the aquifer in the area was in depletion.
City Manager Jack Kramer said there was no evidence the aquifer was in depletion. City wells have been going down at a steady rate since 1975, he said, but there is more than enough water to supply the area for 100 years.
Bayer suggested the city should use the treated effluent to recharge the aquifer because there was no benefit to the community if the city couldn't sell the water for a profit to Hualapai Valley Solar. The company was going to make a profit off the use of the water to generate electricity and the citizens would be left with no water in the end, she said. Did Hualapai Valley Solar really need the extra profit it would generate by using wet-cooled instead of dry-cooled technology?
Kramer explained that Arizona Revised Statute set the city's water and wastewater rates. The city could not make a large profit off the sale of the water. Any profit would go to repairing the system.
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Posted: Monday, November 02, 2009
Article comment by:
garWHY
The average age (isotope test) of water in Arizona is 2000 years old...with some areas 20,000 years old---ask a hydrologist, there is no recharge in the state. All this waste so somebody in another state can heat their swimming pool
Posted: Sunday, November 01, 2009
Article comment by:
No name provided
I am little confused. We could have dry solar, instead we're considering selling a bunch of water while Cerbat water co. is struggling. Hey, they were some of the first ones here.(the Neals?) Lets be just a little fair.
Posted: Saturday, October 31, 2009
Article comment by:
RayK
Let me make sure I have this straight.
15 people showed up, asked questions and behaved respectable?
Then Triple D shows up on the internet to call them names and kiss government butt from a distance of 800 miles?
Some people will do anything for a position of power over others.
Shameless.
Posted: Saturday, October 31, 2009
Article comment by:
No name provided
Say hello to restricted well drilling, lower property values, and people moving out in the middle of the night.
Posted: Saturday, October 31, 2009
Article comment by:
The Phantom Hydrologist
Hey Goatlady--Basin-wide groundwater levels were measured in 1964,1980,1985,1991,1996, and 2006. All of these data are public and have been made available to planners in the City and County.
Additionally, some 80 wells are measured at least annually in Mohave County by ADWR. The 2006 measurement activity formed the basis of a 3-basin study by the USGS, which is now in jeopardy of cancellation due to the proposed budget cuts at ADWR.
Also Mr. Kramer is well qualified to speak on water matters having worked in the City Water department for many years. Try calling your State representatives and complain about the looming budget cuts, and you help save your study. And yes, dry cooling uses less water than wet cooling and should be applied at this plant, despite complaints that it is more costly and less efficient than wet cooling. After, it is a desert. Photovoltaic electric production uses no water. Here is a link to a typical hydrograph in the middle of Kingman's well field. Draw your own conclusions. https://gisweb.azwater.gov/gwsi/Hydrograph.aspx?SiteID=351554113590701
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
REALLY GREEN
Mr. Mayor, have you thought about checking out/learning about dry solar ? Check out Skyline Solar, San Jose, Calif. They are not only dry but have also using recycled materials. Very efficient, and really GREEN.
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
willie
@ Todd
If you read the newspaper. According to the individual named Munger he is running for Gubernatorial Candidate, his quote in the Standard was the entire state will run out of water in 20 years. His words not any one else's. Does this answer your question all the way from Clovis / Portalis, NM. You know helping to show those realtors in New Mexico how to sell homes, just like you did not in Kingman. If you dont like his answer I am sure he has some type of calculation that he figured out, you can contact him and ask him all the was from Clovis / Portalis, NM.
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
wanna be tyrant
I am l00% for solar. Dry solar. Hualapai Project is are going to be tax exempt, put the power in the grid, use Kingman's aquifer water, use labor from other areas, and end up with about 10 jobs after it is built. What benefit is there for Kingman. Mr. Salem can you answer this simple question?
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
V Stokes
DVS...4000 Sq mi? So who sold them a tract of land 63 X 63 miles? Also..3-5% in operating costs can make the difference between profit and loss...of course they can always just charge more for power..but if no one buys..then what?
PV is extremely expensive and inefficient on large scale plants..esp when you don't get tax rebates to offset the costs as homeowners do.
All these new tech methods are wonderful..but they are being heavily subsidized I would imagine.
Hydro,wind and traditional solar are the power of our future, until someone perfects fusion..and then people will probably complain that it blocks their view.
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
Smart Solar Power
Chris is completely right. Solar power can be an important part of Kingman's future, but wet cooling is a wasteful and outdated technology. Many communities in not only Florida but also in California, Nevada, and throughout the west are now requiring that new solar plants use photovoltaic power, which isn't quite as profitable but which uses far less water. Solar power has many benefits, but it must be done wisely --- and in the desert southwest that means being conservative with water resources.
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
No name provided
"the city wouldn't sell water to a company that doesn't follow state regulations" Funny... Salem is all for the bio plant being run by a bunch of people who dont follow regulations with their water co....hmmm
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
DVS
If Mr. Salem is going to be answering questions on wet solar, I think he needs to be doing some serious reserch. For one thing dry solar is a little more expensive, but by only 3-5%,this is documented. And where did you get the information the dry solar uses more space, that is totally wrong. Hualapai Solar is planning on using 4000 square miles, yes thousands..It seems all the information that is being believed by Planning and Zoning is coming from Hualapai Solar themselves, great sales pitch. Do they (P & Z)really believe everything they say...????
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
GOATLADY
Is city manager, Jack Kramer a water expert? And who told him the wells were going down at a steady rate ? and how much ? Thats over 35 years. And who says there is enough for the next 100 years ? There has not been a water study since l986, where is this coming from ?...another good guess...?? Still the unknown factor, but this is a desert, we need a water study before it is approv ed.
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
Loyd
But we still have you representing the "pillage and burn" interests from 800 miles away. Hang in there Tarson!
Posted: Friday, October 30, 2009
Article comment by:
Optimist for growth
Every official that sees the benefits of some development always gets critized as being on the developer's side. There is not one development that gets praised from these few individuals. And if there is one, it is usually a small venture that would add only a couple of jobs to the area.
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